B4trans: From the gist of it, I think Yamato's innocently insensitive remarks at the end belongs in "you're not helping!" pool even though she's just stating the obvious.
The problem with sending soldiers into battle against the abyssals is not that they have human rights, but that they're ineffective. The Vice Admiral just made the argument that they can't send shipgirls into battle while recognizing their resemblance to children, while Yamato argued from the perspective of the shipgirls, humans are like children.
Of course, a number of the abyssals resemble children as well, when you get down to it...
So what's the real issue here?
The suggestion that human rights would lower their combat effectiveness or get in the way of using them against the enemy?
The problem with sending soldiers into battle against the abyssals is not that they have human rights, but that they're ineffective. The Vice Admiral just made the argument that they can't send shipgirls into battle while recognizing their resemblance to children, while Yamato argued from the perspective of the shipgirls, humans are like children.
Of course, a number of the abyssals resemble children as well, when you get down to it...
So what's the real issue here?
The suggestion that human rights would lower their combat effectiveness or get in the way of using them against the enemy?
If the human wants the shipgirls to be weapon they couldve just not made them with personalities and learning capabilty to begin with (disregarding the fact that a large part of the shipgirls are purified Abyssals at least in Ido’s universe).
All this about treating them like weapons sounds like a straight route to Skynet for me.
If the human wants the shipgirls to be weapon they couldve just not made them with personalities and learning capabilty to begin with (disregarding the fact that a large part of the shipgirls are purified Abyssals at least in Ido’s universe).
All this about treating them like weapons sounds like a straight route to Skynet for me.
At the same time though, for more power, you also wouldn't just want a walking Gun working off basic sensors and shooting stuff at random. So the Self learning can be seen as a good thing as well. After all, in the real world, we've had problems with self automated turrets accidently shooting their own side.
And also does this Dark Admiral already have the approval from the US, European and Russian high commands for his plans regarding the foreign shipgirls? Especially for the former two that has military doctrines that relying on the independent thinking of their frontline soldiers.
At the same time though, for more power, you also wouldn't just want a walking Gun working off basic sensors and shooting stuff at random. So the Self learning can be seen as a good thing as well. After all, in the real world, we've had problems with self automated turrets accidently shooting their own side.
I mean, its basically the old dilemma with commanders and soldiers, isn't it?
Commanders want soldiers who follow orders and don't do anything else, basically robots, but robots don't really have the crucial decision making skills that soldiers on the ground can make.
I kinda remembered what me late gramps said once during his time in WW2: your officer tells you to set the sugarcane field on fire and he expects you to respond with "how hot do you want the fire to be?"
And also does this Dark Admiral already have the approval from the US, European and Russian high commands for his plans regarding the foreign shipgirls? Especially for the former two that has military doctrines that relying on the independent thinking of their frontline soldiers.
A previous page implies that the way the Japanese admirals (bar the protagonist) treat their shipgrils is the exception rather than the rule, and that foreign bodies are pressuring them into granting human rights to shipgirls.
By the way, seeing how many of the Abyssals are corrupted shipgirls, how many of them do you think are actually ex-shipgirls that were driven to the breaking point by how the Japanese admirals treated them and deserted to become Abyssals?
By the way, seeing how many of the Abyssals are corrupted shipgirls, how many of them do you think are actually ex-shipgirls that were driven to the breaking point by how the Japanese admirals treated them and deserted to become Abyssals?
This made me think that maybe the HQ is in on it for profits, doing that to keep the war going on.
YAMATO: Admiral, if you wish, I could anhillate this person for you and the escort too.
DARK ADMIRAL: What... the hell did she just say?
ADMIRAL: Yamato, please stop helping...
Frawnkenstein said:
B4trans: From the gist of it, I think Yamato's innocently insensitive remarks at the end belongs in "you're not helping!" pool even though she's just stating the obvious.
JEP2004 said:
Yamato stop helping
No, keep helping. I want to see him run headfirst into the indomitable wall of innocence and purity that is Yamato.
Edit: There’s also the fact that she is right. What’s he going to do, give an old fashioned IJN beat down to the 70k+ ton embodiment of Japanese naval might? And while Yamato might be too sweet to do anything to him, Musashi, as others have pointed out, isn’t.
No, keep helping. I want to see him run headfirst into the indomitable wall of innocence and purity that is Yamato.
Edit: There’s also the fact that she is right. What’s he going to do, give an old fashioned IJN beat down to the 70k+ ton embodiment of Japanese naval might? And while Yamato might be to sweet to do anything to him, Musashi, as others have pointed out, isn’t.
But Yamato isn't 70k+ tons of steel anymore. She's 100+ pounds of human meatstuff and he could hurt her by aiming for her new weak point: her feelings.
If the human wants the shipgirls to be weapon they couldve just not made them with personalities and learning capabilty to begin with (disregarding the fact that a large part of the shipgirls are purified Abyssals at least in Ido’s universe).
All this about treating them like weapons sounds like a straight route to Skynet for me.
This assumes they had a choice in the matter.
And he does have a point that if they recognize them as people then sending them off to war is effectively a war crime.
But Yamato isn't 70k+ tons of steel anymore. She's 100+ pounds of human meatstuff and he could hurt her by aiming for her new weak point: her feelings.
Yeah, if previous pages are any indication, aiming for Yamato's "weakpoint" that way is asking for a body blow.
And he does have a point that if they recognize them as people then sending them off to war is effectively a war crime.
This Brings up the "they are Actually 80 years old" Defense. Worst comes to worse they just add a Clause to the rules of warfare, Certainly would look better than dealing with the human rights fallout after the war.
A previous page implies that the way the Japanese admirals (bar the protagonist) treat their shipgrils is the exception rather than the rule, and that foreign bodies are pressuring them into granting human rights to shipgirls.
By the way, seeing how many of the Abyssals are corrupted shipgirls, how many of them do you think are actually ex-shipgirls that were driven to the breaking point by how the Japanese admirals treated them and deserted to become Abyssals?
This has always confused me, why are so many japanese Admirals such disgusting monsters to their fleets?
This has always confused me, why are so many japanese Admirals such disgusting monsters to their fleets?
Blame the IJA/IJN.
It isn't really openly taught today, not helped that the Japanese (quite understandably) do not want their past atrocities to be openly aired, but to simply put warcrimes were standard practice for them.
And he does have a point that if they recognize them as people then sending them off to war is effectively a war crime.
At the same time the girls recognize that they are the only ones who can effectively fight the abyssals, and that no matter how young they look, they are still physical manifestations of ships of war. To bring up Iowa’s quote again, their sole purpose and reason they’ve been given human forms and minds isn’t to just garner deeds of arms and destroy their enemies. But that said, it is a reason for their appearance. And if the shipgirls want to fight for humanity who’s right is it to stop them.
Funny thing is that Yamato probably do mean well. "Humans are just so, well, helplessly powerless...but it's okay, because you have us!" Kinda reminds me of the YoRHa androids from Nier Automata...
This has always confused me, why are so many japanese Admirals such disgusting monsters to their fleets?
You know those jokes you sometimes see about shipgirls beating disobedient peers with bats? Yeah, that's not really a joke, that was common practice in the IJN of that period among other atrocious treatment of of it's personnel. People focus in on Kamikazes and banzai charges and shit, but that was just the desperate, extreme manifestation of a more mundanely cruel and toxic organization culture that existed long before the war. Presuming such individuals are modeled on the officers of similiar vintage to the girls they treat them like shit because of the IJN of that time treated nearly everyone who as part of it like shit.
She means well, really...Humans are just so, well, helplessly powerless...Certainly, there is a difference between people and shipgirls...Can we really wage war whilst protecting the 'human rights' of shipgirls?Hah, don't make me laugh. Shipgirls? Being human beings?And then from that precedent, we will move one step closer to imposing a unified treatment of shipgirls as weapons.If you're taking these girls to court-martial over misconduct unbefitting of "military personnel"...I say this with all due respect, but...Court-martial it might be, but the only charge being brought is over your ineptitude at weapons operations and management.If I'm headed to a court-martial no matter what, then in for a penny, in for a pound...Truly a joyous occasion.The battle against the Abyssal Fleet rages on.If we were to grant them official recognisance as 'people', it would become impossible to send them off to fight monsters on the fields of battle.Shipgirls can, and must, be treated as nothing more than weapons, and weapons alone.
For the sake of humanity.Just think about it. These girls - these children - looking so very young...then the military authorities must have considered that by doing so, the human rights of shipgirls that have been in a grey area will be forevermore set in stone after the fact, correct?You said that it was... military regulations that were violated...What... what did you...It would be futile for soldiers to do so as well, no?
